Important! My engine is being overhauled....as if the.key fob issue was not enough....

[XFireXLR]

Sounds like theirs a little progress good. What exactly did they decide replacing? I think what busa is talking about is the burn marks on the paths of where the cams ride the valves. The journals should have a polished look like some of the others. Means your getting to much friction ,heat buildup,loss of lubrication?

I thank you guys for the observations, and I will address it tomorrow when I do my daily inspection. My understanding is that both heads, all valves, all pistons, timing chains, all cams, journals, all gaskets, fuel rails, spark plugs and coil packs.....a total upper engine rebuild. The shop that is doing most of the work is highly regarded and reputable. I also mentioned that I was going to order the XLR V sway bar and pay for the labor out of pocket while the car is apart. The service manager ordered it and will have it installed at thier expense.

 

[Stella]

What I don't understand is. If their gonna replace sounds like 80% of the engine why didn't they just replace the entire engine? I would think the labor bills are gonna b more than a complete 0 mile engine. When you get your baby back I would drive it ALL the time put it through as many heat cycles as possible. It's always the unknown that will bite yah. Thinking of the cams. Do you start your car during the winter. Those burns could be from cold start without proper lube,or possibly the lead foot driving at 6500 rpms all the time What's weird is the marks arn't consistent. If your interested in sway bars. I actually went through GM parts direct and purchased c6 zr1 sway bars front and back for like 225.00. The stock sway bar is is 17 mm. The zr1 bar is 25.6 mm. I never had the stock one but I figured the bigger the less diving will b done, and no it didn't change the ride otherwise.

 

[XFireXLR]

What I don't understand is. If their gonna replace sounds like 80% of the engine why didn't they just replace the entire engine? I would think the labor bills are gonna b more than a complete 0 mile engine. When you get your baby back I would drive it ALL the time put it through as many heat cycles as possible. It's always the unknown that will bite yah. Thinking of the cams. Do you start your car during the winter. Those burns could be from cold start without proper lube,or possibly the lead foot driving at 6500 rpms all the time What's weird is the marks arn't consistent. If your interested in sway bars. I actually went through GM parts direct and purchased c6 zr1 sway bars front and back for like 225.00. The stock sway bar is is 17 mm. The zr1 bar is 25.6 mm. I never had the stock one but I figured the bigger the less diving will b done, and no it didn't change the ride otherwise.

The car as it sits right now the labor cost is approximately at $7400.00, thier price for a new Northstar crate engine approximately $5700.00. When all is said and done thier labor and parts cost will be somewhere around $10K plus, the math is easy and that does not include the little residual tweaks down the road. I will address those issues on Monday since this is the techs weekend off. As for cold starts the winters here in Central Virginia are mild, about 39 degrees at its worst. There are a few time where the car is not driven for 3 or 4 days, but on those occasions and all other occasions I never over rev the engine when starting. I will suggest that they order the C6/Z06 sway bars instead of the V sway bars. I have to give them the chance to make it right, the cost is not my concern. Time wise if they would have just dropped in a new engine, I would have been back on the road by now. I have to give the tech his due respect, he is doing a meticulous job and is treating the car as if it was his own.

 

[XFireXLR]

Went to the dealership today for my daily inspection and progress is being made. The engine is now mated back to the drivetrain. All observations from forum members have been addressed and corrected. The tech said the car should be back together by Wednesday and back to me by Friday.

 

[klaptrapper]

My 2c, The dealership makes money on the 7,400 labor bill. I doubt the installation of the crate would yield them much more than a K.
FWIW

Rusty 06 V

The car as it sits right now the labor cost is approximately at $7400.00, thier price for a new Northstar crate engine approximately $5700.00. When all is said and done thier labor and parts cost will be somewhere around $10K plus, the math is easy and that does not include the little residual tweaks down the road. I will address those issues on Monday since this is the techs weekend off. As for cold starts the winters here in Central Virginia are mild, about 39 degrees at its worst. There are a few time where the car is not driven for 3 or 4 days, but on those occasions and all other occasions I never over rev the engine when starting. I will suggest that they order the C6/Z06 sway bars instead of the V sway bars. I have to give them the chance to make it right, the cost is not my concern. Time wise if they would have just dropped in a new engine, I would have been back on the road by now. I have to give the tech his due respect, he is doing a meticulous job and is treating the car as if it was his own.

 

[ChicagoDave]

My 2c, The dealership makes money on the 7,400 labor bill. I doubt the installation of the crate would yield them much more than a K.
FWIW

Rusty 06 V

Considering the dealer is not getting "warranty" work for this - I don't think the dealer is making ANY money - unless the dealer is filing an insurance claim with their insurance. If I remember correctly, the warranty company has backed out of it - claiming dealer negligence?

 

[XFireXLR]

Chicago Dave......you are correct GMPP is only paying for the vacuum leak not the collateral damage caused by/after the initial repair.

 

[klaptrapper]

Yes, agreed. I think it is an insurance issue..............now. But I don't think that was "determined" until after the engine was disassembled . By that time there was considerable "sunk cost". dunno.
Rusty 06 V

Chicago Dave......you are correct GMPP is only paying for the vacuum leak not the collateral damage caused by/after the initial repair.

 

[XFireXLR]

And here is the culprit.....

 

[XFireXLR]

Well she is all back together and should be fired up later today......got my fingers crossed.

 

[tyrone]

new motor

Well, did they get running without the noise? Is it home yet?

 

[XFireXLR]

Well, did they get running without the noise? Is it home yet?

None of the above as yet, now I am told it needs a new oil pump. The oil pump has been ordered and should be in on Monday.

 

[XLRATING]

Geesh, the oil pump bit it too? I am so sorry! Your XLR is going to have completely new innards by the end.

 

[SrChief]

My next question to them would be how long did they run it before they decided they had no oil pressure and needed a new pump! As an old aircraft mechanic if we found something like that in an engine it was time for a new engine!

 

[airmike]

I don't care how long they ran it with low/no oil pressure, they or nobody else can tell how much wear occurred without taking it apart. For my money that is the biggest red flag yet. I doubt there is any significant wear, but no one knows, they can only think, guess, hope.

from stella's post: Sounds like theirs a little progress good. What exactly did they decide replacing? I think what busa is talking about is the burn marks on the paths of where the cams ride the valves. The journals should have a polished look like some of the others. Means your getting to much friction ,heat buildup,loss of lubrication?

I almost didn't post this because I don't want to be negative. I just can't stand the what if! We all love these cars and want to keep that feeling. If it was my car and I was capable of wrenching on it, and it was my money I would probably take the chance. Its their money and owner can't repair.

 

[Stella]

X fire I feel bad for you but I would demand a new motor. When busa and I responded about the cam journals we didn't know about the oil pump. That shows that the top end of the engine wasn't getting oil pressure. So that means that either the oil pump was fubared on the initial start or on the second brain fart start. Was obviously started with NO oil pressure. I noticed in earlier pics. that the oil pump is in front of engine by crankshaft does that mean their gonna take the drivetrain down again? Whoever inspected your engine should have disassembled your entire engine mic'ed every journal and checked EVERY component. I wouldn't take any advice from anyone at the dealer about your engine. At this point their probably so fed up with your car, and loss of money, that they just wanna get you out of there. I totally understand that you just want your baby back how she was but today's motors are that much more precise. The tolerances in today's motors are tight the unforeseen is gonna be the devil for them and you. CRATE MOTOR remember these guys work at a dealer that services the car. How many engines you think your local dealer rebuild. I now know how many they've ruined!GOOD LUCK

 

[tyrone]

broken motor

Having rebuilt or replaced motors in the past and being a car guy, my car buddies having done the same, its good practice to replace the oil pump, the water pump and install a new radiator. Some warranties on crate motors are void unless a new radiator is installed. A new oil and water pump should have been planned for during the tear down on your motor. I would ask about a new water pump also.

 

[XFireXLR]

Well the car should be ready later today so says the service manager, this is yet to be seen. The only other thing that needs to be addressed and looked at is the driver side rocker panel that was scratched severely. Below is a link to why the oiul pump needed to be replaced, and all owners should read it.

IMPORTANT PLEASE READ!!!!!!

https://www.xlr-net.com/forums/cadillac-xlr-technical-discussion-33/possible-oil-pump-failures-due-oil-changes-5867/

 

[BusaMan]

Damage on Damage

Well, I guess I'd hafta have the Service Manager stand up to the rocker panel damage. It's clear that his tech' wasn't "schooled" on the jack points OR even the need for the rubber disc over the lift point. It doesn't seem that they even used a "legal" jack point.

This whole episode has to have been a nightmare for you. Did Caron ever get in touch with you about how this has been (to use Stella's term) FUBARed from the beginning?

You've done all of us a huge favor by keeping us informed of the goings-on w/ your vehicle. If our oil pumps really won't reliably self-prime, then that's an engineering failure of the first order, IMO. However, that being said, it's awfully tough to accept that that's the case, given the tens of thousands of oil changes that have been performed on the XLRs sold. Maybe Cadillac Tech can weigh in on this. I tend to believe that the same tech responsible for adding unwanted parts to your engine (nut/bolt...) just MIGHT have contributed to the oil pump problem; but then again, I might be wrong...

Did you ever get the total list of everything they did, and everything they replaced, when they rebuilt your engine? I believe I'd be awfully tempted to only go a few hundred miles on the first post-build oil change, if it were my car. This would help w/ the peace of mind that most all of the metal particles were gone from the engine.

We feel your pain, for sure.

Tim

Well the car should be ready later today so says the service manager, this is yet to be seen. The only other thing that needs to be addressed and looked at is the driver side rocker panel that was scratched severely. Below is a link to why the oiul pump needed to be replaced, and all owners should read it.

IMPORTANT PLEASE READ!!!!!!

https://www.xlr-net.com/forums/cadi...sible-oil-pump-failures-due-oil-changes-5867/

 

[XFireXLR]

Well, I guess I'd hafta have the Service Manager stand up to the rocker panel damage. It's clear that his tech' wasn't "schooled" on the jack points OR even the need for the rubber disc over the lift point. It doesn't seem that they even used a "legal" jack point.

This whole episode has to have been a nightmare for you. Did Caron ever get in touch with you about how this has been (to use Stella's term) FUBARed from the beginning?

You've done all of us a huge favor by keeping us informed of the goings-on w/ your vehicle. If our oil pumps really won't reliably self-prime, then that's an engineering failure of the first order, IMO. However, that being said, it's awfully tough to accept that that's the case, given the tens of thousands of oil changes that have been performed on the XLRs sold. Maybe Cadillac Tech can weigh in on this. I tend to believe that the same tech responsible for adding unwanted parts to your engine (nut/bolt...) just MIGHT have contributed to the oil pump problem; but then again, I might be wrong...

Did you ever get the total list of everything they did, and everything they replaced, when they rebuilt your engine? I believe I'd be awfully tempted to only go a few hundred miles on the first post-build oil change, if it were my car. This would help w/ the peace of mind that most all of the metal particles were gone from the engine.

We feel your pain, for sure.

Tim

Tim....I agree with your statements. I am on my way there as we speak. The service manager is aware of the rocker panel issue and said that he will make it right. This has been a nightmare . and after all is said and done I might just sell her and look for an XLR V. as a replacement.